That Shipping Meme

[thisbluespirit]

Ganked from hamsterwoman a week ago, but it's been going around:

1. List three shipping tropes you love

In fic, presumably? I do like Forced Proximity, Fake Relationship, and Hurt/Comfort, but honestly, whatever suits the ship in question, or the author can pull off.


2. List three shipping tropes you don't love

Omegaverse, pregnancy/kidfic, fluffy/mundane-type AUs (I can enjoy a bit of fluff; I can enjoy even a mundane other setting AU if it's cleverly translating canon, but not if it's been used to remove what was interesting to me about the fandom and ship in the first place, and there do seem to be a great wash of shipfic like this about. It makes it harder to like a super-popular pairing than a small one, because how do you weed all that out? Some of it might be good!)

(Also philomytha pointed out that this kind of thing is prone to make your brain unwisely try to work out how to do the thing in a way you would like. Although I can't see that happening for Omegaverse, because it's generally pretty explicit by nature, but let's move swiftly on just in case...)


3. One emotional aspect of a ship that always gets you

Loyalty? I think, gen or romantic, I like an intense indefinable connection that goes beyond sex? (I'm rubbish at tropes. lol) There should be some sort of idk neither obstacle nor difference nor inequality sounds quite right, but there should be something in the way?

It's one of the things I love about Doctor Who - the central relationship(s) of this series are the Doctor & the companion, who (romantically or platonically) go from strangers to developing an intense bond through adventures, risking their lives for each other, placing great faith in each other - we see on screen both instances of the companion having faith in the Doctor but also that if the Doctor has faith in anything, it's their companions, both individually, over and over, but also literally, when the Seventh Doctor repels vampires by faith, he's reciting the names of every companion under his breath, and this is something that's only continued since.

The more intense and indefinable and strong and fragile and romantic and platonic all at the same time, the btter, with bonus points if with a side of deeply screwed up - I love Seven & Ace, Eight/Charley, Six&/Evelyn, Doctor&/Clara, Five/Tegan especially.


4. One physical aspect of a ship that always gets you

I don't know. Hand-holding/things involving hands are nice? Undressing, maybe? idk, can you tell I cannot do smut much, really?


5. Multiship or monoship?

Multiship. Sometimes I'm OTPish about something, but mostly even where I am, I can spend a night out with a different ship for the characters, right?

I used to deliberately write randomly generated pairings all the time, although increasingly, it feel as rather as if fandom has forgotten too much of the 'what if' and 'have fun' bits of fanficcing. ("You ship that?" "No, I just wanted to see how it would go if it did go!")

/runs 100ships

But simultaneously, I am so OT3ish and indeed Elements/Elements for Sapphire & Steel that I often can't read Sapphire/Steel unless I know who the author is because, even though that is obviously a reasonable and beautiful and canonical ship I write myself, I get sad because why so exclusive, WHY NO SILVER??????????????

So, yep. I am as unreasonable, hypocritical and inconsistent as the next person.


6. Rare pairs or mainstream?

Given that I do ship Swan Queen from OUaT, and some other things, technically both. But, really I'm rare everything when it comes to fandom most of the time. I say I didn't mean to be, but the only Swan Queen fic I wrote was terrifying. The AO3 hit count went up visibly and then people told me I had ruined their life. I think crickets are better.

But also, if there are 1000s of works in a ship already, I don't feel like there's any point in me adding to the pile, especially if no one else I know is into it. That gets very lonely fast in particular, because everybody else's fic for the pairing gets comments from apparently twenty people in a Discord whereas you might get kudos but no interaction. (SW was like this, although months and months later, some commenting did start after I was recced on tumblr, but it was weird for me, not being used to being in a megafandom, or any knowledge of how that worked in the current day.)

That obscure ship for a canon that has no fandom and nobody has ever written or will ever want? Well. Somebody has to do it, it would be wrong for me to have watched/read, and yet not have written the thing! So I did. tbh, I do usually still feel Accomplished for it.


7. Polyamory or monogamy?

Both, dependent on characters. Or what I felt like that day.

I don't have many OT3s or moresomes, but one of my most OTPish of OTPs is the Silver/Sapphire/Steel OT3 because what else do you do with them? ;-p

But it's not like that stops Sapphire/Steel being the two who are the two, or Silver having a thing with Copper, and Steel needing to get hugged on a regular basis by Lead, or having something with Jet apparently. Or all three of them flirting with humans and any other elements when it gets the job done.

(I'm very elements/elements. They're so wonderfully non-human and yet they clearly feel things for each other and they combine in endlessly different and useful ways because of course they do.)


Do I have many others? There's definitely also Annabelle/Jason/Stewart from Department S, who are all human. I mean, if they're not sleeping in each other's hotel rooms together forever, what is the point? They might be a bit more of V formation around Stewart, but idk, Jason's not one to be left out of anything, and Annabelle will want to know what the fuss is about Jason sooner or later. (I'm not sure that will go well for Jason. She may give him notes, or suggestions for what Mark Caine should do better in his next novel. Or rate each try on the computer. Certainly, something that would outrage Jason anyway. Stewart usually goes in the middle for good reasons.)


Oh, yes, and Lucy/Mina/John and John/Mina/Jonathan for Dracula (1968), because it's a very multishippy adaptation. It isn't faithful but it absolutely understands about that.


8. If the ship is physical, reversible or not?

hamsterwoman pointed out this is probably about topping/bottoming. Otherwise I'd have been here for ages going, do they mean one-sided? Both pining by turns?? Why is that only physical?

Which tells you everything you need to know about my feelings re. topping/bottoming.


9. Do you always have romantic ships for fandoms?

No, not necessarily! But I am a curious writer. In one sense I'm not very shippy, even my attempts wind up as gen, but I love exploring almost any what if scenario, including, how would this unlikely pair get together if somehow they inadvisably did? Also random generators, as I've said.

But I'm not only fannish if I have an OTP. It's very nice and can definitely add impetus, especially when shared, but not necessary.



10. How important is the sexual part (if any) of your ship?

It depends. If they are a time and space machine and a mysterious Time Lord, or three shiny elemental mysterious whatsits who would look amused at the idea, then it's not important at all. It's not necessarily important to some humans, either, or to me.

But sometimes it obviously matters to the ship, or I do really want them to. I am not a smut writer, but I can fade decently to black all right if I try, and sometimes that needs to happen, at least in fic.



11. Opinion on platonic ships?

I'm interested in characters interacting, and I do have some platonic ships that I can be intense about, and some where I don't mind which way round it is, because canon platonic relationship is already quite intense.

Also maybe my trope up the top should be "intense, indefinable ships" so that does tend to lead to instances like that. (Oh, wait: I did say that! <-- I answered the first bit of this meme a week before the second)

And, as I mentioned, DW is great for having platonic ships I feel intensely about (who among us does not have Two & Jamie & Zoe feels? And I've already mentioned Seven & Ace, bu there's One & Vicki, Eight & Lucie & Twelve & Bill, and so many others).

And I do have other ships where honestly I don't care which way round it is as long as they're together and Like That (see list above, probably missing some), including Swan Queen, even though I do also have strong shippy feels there.

I like ensemble shows, too, which are often great for all kinds of dynamics that can be fun to pull out and play with - OUaT has loads of fun 'ships of all kinds.

Plus, Indigo & Grimya from the Indigo Saga are amazing platonic endgame ship of immortal telepathic wolf & human bffs and they are the main thing I care about in that series, and I don't think they could be really romantic. (I suppose they could be sexual if Indigo was wolf Indigo at the time, but idk.)


12. List 3 ships you currently love

Sir Robert Morton/Catherine Winslow apparently.
Five/Tegan ;-p
I'm still having entirely isolated Colin/Matty from Wish Me Luck feels, because that's what happens after writing Yule-letters for fandoms that go unwritten.

That is random, but they were the first that came to mind right now, which, I suppose, is therefore as good an answer as any.


13. List 5 OTPs from past fandoms

What do you mean 'past fandoms?' I don't understand this concept! ;-p


Okay, some ships I have written a lot in the past, but not so much in the last two or three years:

Mina/Lucy/John from Dracula 1968
Brig/Liz Shaw
Adam Adamant/Georgina Jones
Harry Sullivan/Sarah Jane Smith

If you want my absolute oldest, then the only one I'm sure of, even if I never had a fandom to interact with, I was writing Hank/Sheila from Dungeons & Dragons (Cartoon) in my diary when I was about 14. Anything else stayed in my head. (I'm really very thankful I did not have any sort of proper access to the internet and fandom until I was 18. It would have been immensely embarrassing to look back on, because everything else in my head was much less sensible than Hank/Sheila, which would have been fine. I think I did maybe write it once for Yuletide, even.)


14. Opinion on the importance of marriage?

For fictional characters? For fiction of fictional characters? My opinion currently is that I feel alarmed about the writer of these questions more than anything else.

It depends what the characters would feel about it. Some of them wouldn't be able to get together without it because of period/character, to some it could never even apply to them, and some definitely shouldn't or wouldn't want to, or couldn't.

But, in another sense - I do like some Marriage fanfic tropes - forced marriage, accidental marriage, arranged marriage, marriage of convenience. I have done the Just Married fic exchange a couple of times and pined when I can't.


15. Opinion on OC kids?

Nooooo.

I mean, if I wrote it myself, for Reasons, obviously that would be fine. But in general unless I know and have faith in the author, it is merely a useful indication that now is the time for pressing that back button.

Comments

[romanajo123]

Oh, I keep forgetting about 100ships! I do have ideas, it's just... doing it?


Yeah, I looked up what Omegaverse was when I saw it on one of those " AU month" prompt lists on Tumblr. It's a hard pass from me too. I'm still not clear what makes an AU "mundane?" I feel like I'd need an example?


"No, I just want to see how it would go!" ... Awww, I feel like you just described my current descent into the Anyelle/ Anyem rabbit hole. :P


Huh, I actually hadn't given much thought to the Brig and Liz.

[thisbluespirit]

I'm still not clear what makes an AU "mundane?" I feel like I'd need an example?

Mundane = ordinary, normal etc. Everything & everybody is now ordinary and modern day - any superpowers, magic, sci-fi or supernatural elements in canon are gone & historical canons are modern.

Huh, I actually hadn't given much thought to the Brig and Liz.

About, um, 16 years ago or so, I couldn't stop thinking about it, lol. There were many words.

And, yeah, no rush for 100ships! I'm very slow too.

[liadt]

everybody else's fic for the pairing gets comments I've noticed in Instagram people will only comment to their "friends" while ignoring other comments, so I think commenting is out of fashion(!).

The importance of marriage question does come across more what your personal world view is!

[thisbluespirit]

Yes, although I do get now that megafandoms can be crappy and so commenting to strangers can be scarier than in smaller fandoms. I just remember how many comments the big fandoms seemed to get on LJ, so it felt awful to me. At least now I know that it doesn't mean everybody just thinks I'm rubbish. They just don't want to talk. :-/

The importance of marriage question does come across more what your personal world view is!

It is unfair of me to criticise all the memes rather than making a new, fun one myself, but it is phrased a little bit unfortunately - given the context, I don't suppose they meant that!

[theseatheseatheopensea]

Hand holding and intense, indefinable ships are the best, always! <3

(I'm very elements/elements. They're so wonderfully non-human and yet they clearly feel things for each other and they combine in endlessly different and useful ways because of course they do.)

Yessssssssssss! <3

[thisbluespirit]

Indeed. <3

[kerk_hiraeth]

I must be getting old; most of those terms are alien to ne :-)

Judging by your descriptions I may also be lucky I don't understand them.

I do remember being quite shocked when someone said I wrote femslash but, apparently, the term had evolved and I had indeed been writing femslash.

Some of what those ladies who invented K/S, and thus Slash-fiction wrote stories that would scare pr0nstars back to their mammas!

I read some B7 slash-fic at a who/B7 con once and it beat some of the gay pr0n fic I used to buy. :-)

kerk

[thisbluespirit]

Fandom terminology is always changing and people in different fandoms use different terms anyway. It's always confusing.

[astrogirl]

That obscure ship for a canon that has no fandom and nobody has ever written or will ever want? Well. Somebody has to do it

Honestly, this is my attitude about niche fic stuff in general. Yeah, it's probably not going to get you showers of kudos and catapult you into BNF-hood (although I have sometimes been surprised at there being more of an audience for certain things than I expected). But, the way I see it, a) fanfic writing is (or should be) mostly about having fun, having a creative outlet, and externalizing whatever it is that's currently taking over your brain before you burst from it, not about achieving internet celebrity, and b) no matter how weird and obscure the thing you're writing is, some day, someone is going to come along who is craving that exact thing, and when they find it, you will make their freaking day and both of you will know, if only for a moment, the warm feeling of encountering a kindred soul. Which, IMO, makes it entirely worthwhile. (Mind you, as someone who's mostly written at least somewhat more popular stuff, maybe that's hypocritical of me. But, then again, I did, at least once in my life, write the very first fic on AO3 for a particular thing, so maybe not. :))

Very much looking forward to being the meme-sheep on this one when I have time. Just reading over the questions, I find I have some surprisingly rambly opinions forming in my head.

[thisbluespirit]

no matter how weird and obscure the thing you're writing is, some day, someone is going to come along who is craving that exact thing, and when they find it, you will make their freaking day and both of you will know, if only for a moment, the warm feeling of encountering a kindred soul.

It is always one of the joys of fandom, but it frequently does only happen about three years later, which is a long time to wait for feedback on a fic!

Mind you, as someone who's mostly written at least somewhat more popular stuff, maybe that's hypocritical of me. But, then again, I did, at least once in my life, write the very first fic on AO3 for a particular thing, so maybe not. :

LOL, I was going to say, no, not at all, of course not, and then I read the "once" part, and I did that three times just last year, so maybe not. ;-p (On the only three works I wrote for the first six months! lol Of course, that is nobody's fault but mine, but what does that have to say to anything?)

And as I was slow to answer this, I've already enjoyed reading your responses!

[astrogirl]

but it frequently does only happen about three years later, which is a long time to wait for feedback on a fic!

True, one does have to be annoyingly patient!

and then I read the "once" part, and I did that three times just last year, so maybe not. ;-p

LOL! Well, if it helps, I meant the first for the fandom there, not for the pairing, but still. You are definitely the winner of the obscurlympics, anyway. :)

[thisbluespirit]

LOL! Well, if it helps, I meant the first for the fandom there, not for the pairing, but still.

So did I! If we're talking pairings, I did that 4 times last year. XD

tbf I find being in big fandoms where they just ignore you or tell you how you have ruined their lives worse than being ignored because I wrote something I knew everyone would ignore anyway. So you're just braver than me!

Although I do recall that I used to be able to write and be fannish in some way in between those two things and it was nice, but alas. Idk how to make that work any more!

You are definitely the winner of the obscurlympics, anyway. :)

Thank you. *holds sad small trophy only half-aloft*

[astrogirl]

tbf I find being in big fandoms where they just ignore you or tell you how you have ruined their lives worse than being ignored because I wrote something I knew everyone would ignore anyway.

Whereas I have no major problems with being ignored, whatever the reason. (Yes, even though when I post something I do obsessively refresh it looking to see if there are kudos. I embrace my contradictions!) I think it's a weird combination of humility -- "Ah, well, I don't expect that much attention, anyway, who am I, really?" -- and ego -- "People keep writing this wrong and I have to show them how it's done, and it's not my fault if they don't read it because they have no taste!"

And I think most of the times when someone has told me I ruined their life (or words to that effect), it's been a compliment. Like, your fic made me cry and I can't stop thinking about it, you monster! Which just makes me preen and/or laugh evilly. :)

But maybe I've lucked out there.

[thisbluespirit]

"Ah, well, I don't expect that much attention, anyway, who am I, really?" -- and ego -- "People keep writing this wrong and I have to show them how it's done, and it's not my fault if they don't read it because they have no taste!"

LOL, although, that is also a fair assessment of popular fandoms and ships quite often, really.

I am fine being ignored where I expect to be ignored, and I think now I've experienced what a current megafandom is actually like (i.e. God forbid anyone should talk to you outside of the Discord, wherever THAT may be), I would be less freaked out, but my venture into SW died after about three months because I was so terrified by the silence.

Months after that, I discovered a BNF had written beautiful recs of my fic on tumblr on a private post, but never ever bothered even to so much as give me a kudos on AO3. It's another world! I was used to my DW corner where usually someone'll comment at least once if you're not being TOO weird. (Sometimes I am too weird. XD)

But, yeah - now I've gathered my experience was pretty much usual and not because they all hated me secretly or something, I'd probably be more okay in future. But idk, is commenting a tiny comment too much to ask when you're writing your amazing secret rec??? /grumbly unfair author rah rah rah

*ahem*

(The Swan Queen people did not want my fic, but, tbf, it was not my best! I need to write a Swan Queen fic I'm happy with one day. It will be niggling at me forever if I don't.)

[astrogirl]

LOL, although, that is also a fair assessment of popular fandoms and ships quite often, really.

It's amazing how often "everyone else is doing it wrong!" is a motivator for me. :) Although, much to my surprise, sometimes it actually works? Like, I literally just last night posted a fic whose entire, explicitly stated point was, "Yeah, I keep reading all these post-canon fics where these characters who spent 30 years hating each other reconcile and ride off into the sunset together, and some of them are really well done, but, dudes, it neither should nor could happen, so here's how it might actually go." And I figured if I got comments, they'd probably be annoyed ones, but, nope, I got nine freaking comments overnight -- I cannot remember the last time that happened, in any fandom -- and they were almost entirely appreciative. I guess some people do have good taste (read: mine). LOL!

(i.e. God forbid anyone should talk to you outside of the Discord, wherever THAT may be)

Yeah, in some circles, it seems to me like you can barely do fandom as a community outside of Discord, which is sad for me, because from everything I understand about how Discord works (not having ventured into it, myself), it sounds like so not the kind of way I like to engage.

I would be less freaked out, but my venture into SW died after about three months because I was so terrified by the silence.

Oh, man, I can't even imagine writing for something with as all-pervasive a fandom as SW.

Months after that, I discovered a BNF had written beautiful recs of my fic on tumblr on a private post, but never ever bothered even to so much as give me a kudos on AO3.

This sort of thing seems to happen a lot. I just found where someone had bookmarked a fic of mine and wrote this long, glowing, really nice multi-paragraph appreciation of the fic in the bookmark comment field. But did they come into my comments and say it to my face? Nope. Also not so much as a kudos. Which is okay, I guess. I don't feel entitled to it or anything. But it does seem a little weird to me. Maybe a little sad, that people, for whatever reason, don't want to directly engage.

But, yeah - now I've gathered my experience was pretty much usual and not because they all hated me secretly or something, I'd probably be more okay in future.

Yeah, it does seem to be the norm now, at least in a lot of fandoms. I've seen people lamenting in various places about how much less common it is for people to leave comments on the fics of people they don't know and how vanishingly rare it is to strike up conversations in the comments. Although from what I've seen, it varies a lot by fandom.

Anyway, yeah, it's definitely not just you. So hopefully that won't scare you away from writing stuff you want to write in the future.

I think I mostly manage, myself, by assuming pretty much no one will be interested in what I'm writing, so that I can go, "Well, I didn't expect much else" if it doesn't get much response and be very pleasantly surprised if it does.

[thisbluespirit]

I guess some people do have good taste (read: mine). LOL!

But of course! I too think you have excellent taste, save for those few instances where it disagrees with my, obvs even more excellent, taste. XD

because from everything I understand about how Discord works (not having ventured into it, myself), it sounds like so not the kind of way I like to engage.

I have a Discord and I can use it on occasion, but yeah. It's nice for the odd real-time chat of something and I had to get it to advertise when I ran comms and fests and things, but people, it's no way to fandom!!

Oh, man, I can't even imagine writing for something with as all-pervasive a fandom as SW.

Sometimes really weird things happen, like, there you are rewatching the Prequels for fun and suddenly are ambushed by dormant Obidala feels, and then suddenly it's Lockdown AND DW has blown itself to bits with the Timeless Child and all you have left is... intense 20 years of unexpressed Obidala feels and SW fandom won't talk to you when you express them but nevertheless it's a great time to have your head in a Galaxy Far Far Away.

I'd say 2020 was A Year if all the other years since hadn't been competing hard and generally succeeding in Also Being A Year. Although tbf, they did not induce any sudden SW fandom dives in me, it is true.

I'm just saying. Fandom. Weird things happen!

Wookiepedia is a blast, though.

Anyway, yeah, it's definitely not just you. So hopefully that won't scare you away from writing stuff you want to write in the future.

Yes! I am hardier! I have lower expectations! And also I know now that if you're going to not give your ship a happy ending in the fic, it better be a good one and not one you never quite worked out right, and thought: oh well, I shall just post the thing, nobody reads my OUaT fic anyway.

[astrogirl]

But of course! I too think you have excellent taste, save for those few instances where it disagrees with my, obvs even more excellent, taste. XD

Of course! LOL! :)

It's nice for the odd real-time chat of something and I had to get it to advertise when I ran comms and fests and things, but people, it's no way to fandom!!

I miss the old days of LJ so much. And I miss forums. Remember forums? Sigh. And even the old mailing lists...

Sometimes really weird things happen, like, there you are rewatching the Prequels for fun and suddenly are ambushed by dormant Obidala feels

In my experience, when something like that ambushes you, you just have to go with it. Even in normal times, it's often pointless to fight and more fun to give in. And in 2020, especially, any form of insanity that'd get you through was a good thing. (Hell, it might be true for 2025, too, come to that.)

And also I know now that if you're going to not give your ship a happy ending in the fic, it better be a good one and not one you never quite worked out right

Ah, yes, non-happy endings can be a hard sell.

Although, geez, I appear to have just discovered the secret to getting actual meaty comments, at least in one fandom: take the characters who keep getting happy endings in fic but shouldn't and write 7k words of it not happening! (Fandom is so weird and wild. I would not have predicted that ever.)

oh well, I shall just post the thing, nobody reads my OUaT fic anyway.

I've pretty much stopped reading OUaT fic entirely, and was never all that into Swan Queen when I did, but I'll make an exception for you if you like. Because unlike a lot of writers in OUaT fandom, I trust you. :)

[thisbluespirit]

And I miss forums. Remember forums? Sigh. And even the old mailing lists...

I never really got on with forums for fandom. They were too nerve-wracking for me! I did belong to a couple, though, but my forum tactic was always to hang about in the off-topic section discussing a different fandom to the one the forum was for, because that was way safer. I used, and still do use, one of them for family history - the format seems to work for that for me.) I think because fic was always where I started out - I never used mailing lists, I sort of skipped that era with lack of internet after uni, but I have fond memories of newsgroups, which were my first experience of fandom, especially alt.drwho.creative. radw was terrifying, so I retreated from any discussion sites into the fic-writing side. adwc was so small and we were all so polite! I mean, we gave concrit freely and at length in a way that would have us ousted from modern fandom in a heartbeat, but the one time we had a bust up we all immediately agreed it had been a misunderstanding and apologised profusely at each other.

Although, geez, I appear to have just discovered the secret to getting actual meaty comments, at least in one fandom: take the characters who keep getting happy endings in fic but shouldn't and write 7k words of it not happening! (Fandom is so weird and wild. I would not have predicted that ever.)

Oh, that's great! And I'm not really surprised - your fic is always really good anyway.

but I'll make an exception for you if you like. Because unlike a lot of writers in OUaT fandom, I trust you. :)

Aww, that's very kind! Don't worry, you read them at the time, when I was moaning about this back then (in... ooh, 2014? lol, I should get over it, shouldn't I?) I think crossposted that little batch of OUaT stories to LJ, so you presumably read them there instead. But you did, because I remember us talking about it after, even if I may have forgotten everything else since. (You were kind about the Terrible No Good Swan Queen fic, though.)

[astrogirl]

I never really got on with forums for fandom. They were too nerve-wracking for me

I think it helped that the ones I was on tended to be small and niche and very friendly. I still fondly remember the Farscape one that was just where all the Stark fans hung out.

I never used mailing lists, I sort of skipped that era with lack of internet

I was on a couple of Blake's 7 ones back in the day, and they were a lot of fun.

radw was terrifying

That was entirely too nerve-wracking for me! I tried hanging out there very briefly, but the vibe was horrible, and I beat a very sensible retreat.

I mean, we gave concrit freely and at length in a way that would have us ousted from modern fandom in a heartbeat

Yeah, it was the same on the mailing lists. And to a certain extent, I suppose, back in the LJ days. I do kind of miss that, too.

Aww, that's very kind! Don't worry, you read them at the time,

I did remember reading at least some ones you did. Couldn't remember if I'd read all of them, though, or what if anything I might have had to say about them. My OUaT days seem remarkably distant now, and that part of my brain seems to have largely shut itself down.

[thisbluespirit]

eee, fandom in't what it were in the old days, is it? XD Not that parts of it can't still be totally terrifying anyway.

I made friends on Teaspoon when I started using it by blithely going around Britpicking people and pointing out their typos, and I'd probably be blacklisted instead if I tried it now. I'm not sure how everyone put up with it then, either! But I'd not had any fandom experience in between the uni days with the newsgroups and when I finally got internet at home and found Teaspoon, and then LJ, so I just picked up where I'd left off and didn't think about the culture having changed.

LJ was my favourite though! I am glad we still have its format here in Dreamwidth to hang out on, but LJ was my perfect fandom space back in the day. There was awful/scary stuff around, but it was, for me, so much more easily avoided than in any other forum we've had.

My OUaT days seem remarkably distant now, and that part of my brain seems to have largely shut itself down.

I just keep on rewatching it every so often, as I have the DVDs, and it's still such a good time! Mind, I do feel that I never really wrote what I wanted to write for it, either, so it stays niggling vaguely at the side of my fic brain.

[astrogirl]

eee, fandom in't what it were in the old days, is it?

I know! Kids today, mutter, grumble. :)

Not that parts of it can't still be totally terrifying anyway.

Oh, yeah, I think they've gone and invented entirely new and different ways to be terrifying now.

I made friends on Teaspoon when I started using it by blithely going around Britpicking people and pointing out their typos, and I'd probably be blacklisted instead if I tried it now. I

LOL, yeah, people would probably come after you with pitchforks for that these days! Although personally I always appreciate it when someone points out a typo I've made.

I am glad we still have its format here in Dreamwidth to hang out on, but LJ was my perfect fandom space back in the day.

I'm glad for Dreamwidth, too, and that this way of doing fandom still exists (and exists in a space that's not all about corporate profit, too!). But it's not what it was in terms of engagement, of course, and is more and more starting to feel like a fannish backwater. Alas.

I just keep on rewatching it every so often, as I have the DVDs, and it's still such a good time!

I think I just got into it a little too hard for a little too long and burned out a smidge, especially after the final season came along and I had trouble knowing quite what to think of it. And then, of course, other things came along and took over my brain. But at some point the time may be right for me to go back to it and wallow in the nostalgia and and re-experience some of the fun.

Mind, I do feel that I never really wrote what I wanted to write for it, either, so it stays niggling vaguely at the side of my fic brain.

Ah, yeah, that can do it, I think!

[thisbluespirit]

Although personally I always appreciate it when someone points out a typo I've made.

Me, too. /co-signed, your fellow piece of pond-life in this quiet backwater

And then, of course, other things came along and took over my brain. But at some point the time may be right for me to go back to it and wallow in the nostalgia and and re-experience some of the fun.

As they do! Of course, some fandoms you just move on from, and some you come back to, and there aren't any rules about which ones that'll be. I had to get the DVDs to watch OUaT for most of the run, so of course, it was easy for me when I was feeling bad to be just, "Oh, let's watch that again," and it was exactly the right kind of thing for that sort of mood. (Well, easy only when my entire family weren't borrowing different seasons all the time! XD)

[astrogirl]

Of course, some fandoms you just move on from, and some you come back to, and there aren't any rules about which ones that'll be.

No rules, and it can be impossible to predict. Some fandoms, it's all I can think about for years, and then, POOF, suddenly it's barely more than a fond memory. Others I start off not even being all that into, and then somehow while I'm not looking they evolve into a lifelong obsession.

[hamsterwoman]

but let's move swiftly on just in case...)

Hahaha! (Yeah, I do also start thinking about counterexamples and how would this work for me, which usually ends up being some kind of subversion, or else a POV that feels the same about the not-my-favorite trope that I do.)

although increasingly, it feel as rather as if fandom has forgotten too much of the 'what if' and 'have fun' bits of fanficcing.

Now that you mention it, it does feel like those aspects linger sort of only in nostalgia settings, and the newer stuff tends to be more towards "imagine your OTP" [in flower crowns / described by this newspaper headline / etc.] I hadn't thought of that before, but I think you're right that there's a trend away from the random what-if, which was always something I really enjoyed about fandom...

(I'm really very thankful I did not have any sort of proper access to the internet and fandom until I was 18.

Hehe, very much SAME.

[thisbluespirit]

I hadn't thought of that before, but I think you're right that there's a trend away from the random what-if, which was always something I really enjoyed about fandom...

I think it still exists if you get an active small fandom - it seems to be that in larger fandoms, where you find things via the tag, everyone breaks up by character and ship, and casually considering random other ships in that context gets taken as something like heresy. But there always were people who would do the virtual equivalent of look at you as if you were a strange object for even discussing a random pairing - it was just so much easier to also find communities to hang out in where the random and the what if were a fun game to play, and everyone had multishipping comms for the fandom and its own random pairing generator.

And, yeah, I miss that. The people must still be there, but the means of gathering us and protecting us from the monoshipping hordes is not quite there, other than Discord. But if someone's doing it on a Discord, you can't find them.

[thisbluespirit]

Oh, btw, S18 of WILTY has started as of... the week before last? Anyway, this week's had Lucy Beaumont and I was just "It's true" as soon as she started talking, because it's Lucy.

[hamsterwoman]

Haha, OK, I had to go watch the Lucy episode and indeed it was gold! Like the one guy on Lee's team said, "I struggle to believe anything Lucy says", which is why she is so good at this game XD

- it seems to be that in larger fandoms, where you find things via the tag, everyone breaks up by character and ship,

Yeah, I feel like that's what I'm seeing, too. And good point about Discord, where anything at all could be happening at any time, invisible to the rest of fandom... (I keep forgetting fannish Discords are a thing, because it's such a different way of doing fandom than I'm used to...)

[thisbluespirit]

Haha, OK, I had to go watch the Lucy episode and indeed it was gold! Like the one guy on Lee's team said, "I struggle to believe anything Lucy says", which is why she is so good at this game XD

Yeah - it came back about 2 weeks ago, and I was oh, I must tell hamsterwoman, but I didn't - and then as soon as that ep aired, I had to. And even though I have a rule of "It's Lucy, it must be true," I still failed to believe the gravy story over the prop hand one. It was a great episode, yeah. Everyone was on form!

[hamsterwoman]

I still failed to believe the gravy story over the prop hand one.

I was originally thinking it had to be Lucy's person, but then David (I think?) made the point that someone selling gravy under the table and keeping it secret so as not to get sacked would not come admit it on national television, and that swayed me towards the prop hand. But clearly should've gone with the "It's Lucy, it must be true" strategy XD

[sovay]

8. If the ship is physical, reversible or not?

This question has been feeling like some kind of generational shibboleth, because everyone I know who has done this meme has blinked in incomprehension at this question, as I would have done myself. (Did "switch" just fall out of fashion?)

I'm still having entirely isolated Colin/Matty from Wish Me Luck feels, because that's what happens after writing Yule-letters for fandoms that go unwritten.

I hope someone takes you up on them regardless of season.

[thisbluespirit]

This question has been feeling like some kind of generational shibboleth, because everyone I know who has done this meme has blinked in incomprehension at this question, as I would have done myself. (Did "switch" just fall out of fashion?)

I mean, it's just possible that the OP of the meme (way back when, I suspect) phrased it an odd way for some reason, because that's what they called it, or they forgot the usual word while typing, or who knows? And then here we all are picking it up and staring at it in confusion.

I hope someone takes you up on them regardless of season.

It doesn't seem likely, but thank you. <3

[astrogirl]

I mean, it's just possible that the OP of the meme (way back when, I suspect) phrased it an odd way for some reason, because that's what they called it

I think there are actually some fannish circles where people reverse whose name goes first in the pairing -- A/B vs B/A -- based on who's on top. I wonder if that's the context this comes from? (Also, god, please let that never catch on any more widely, please.)

[thisbluespirit]

Also, god, please let that never catch on any more widely, please.)

Don't worry, people can't work out any consistent way of labelling shipping and pairings for two seconds together! The tag-everything gang would just be wildly tagging both regardless as ever, while AO3 would continue solemnly canonising ships by alphabetical order and ruining the system. Unless someone takes over all the fandom platforms and institutes rigid ship top/bottom tagging systems, we're good. Nobody knows how to tag!!

[astrogirl]

Thank you, that's actually a reassuring thought. :)

[ragnarok_08]

Neat answers!!

[thisbluespirit]

Thanks!